electrical problem 97 fzr600

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Jsteen25
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electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:48 pm

Hi guys,
I am new to the site and was thinking maybe some of you might be able to help me out with finding the source of my problem. ok so here it goes:
Yesterday I went to six flags on my bike which is a 1997 fzr600, she started right up and ran like a camp. It still will start up no problem and run great but when I got home I noticed that when I turned the kill switch and key off (the bike is completely turned off at this point, theres no juice running through) I could still hit the start button and the engine will crank over as if the kill switch is off and the ignition is on. VERY STRANGE!!! So basically without the key in and even with the kill switch on, I can still crank the motor with my starter switch.

The worst part about this is that I also noticed that my hi beam switch was not indicating the hi's were on. Come to find out that none of my headlights are working, hi's or low's. If anyone can help me figure out what is the problem with my start button and my headlights that would be awesome. I don't really want to spend the big bucks at a shop that doesn't care how much it costs.
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:22 pm

Either your key switch is busted, you have a loose wire flapping about, or your safe start relay is stuck in the 'ON' position. Your headlights could be the dimmer switch (left grip) or the starter button (right grip) - the starter button breaks the headlight circuit to save all the juice for the starter motor.

Jsteen25
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:26 pm

Thanks Don,
About a week ago I changed my brake pads and I had to open the front brake resivour, spilling brake fluid on the housing for the kill switch and start button. It didn't get on or in any switches though just started to strip some of the paint off the resivour where it ran down. Anyway when I went to start it up yesterday the start button was acting funny and it felt like it was kind of sticking when I pushed it in. I also had to push it 2 or 3 times before I got the button to work properly. I'm hoping if I clean the start button that my headlights will work :/.
For the second half where can I find the safe start relay to see if its stuck? Or is that possible? Seems like that might be it because my key switch works (Idk but is that the thing where you turn the key?) hehe. Worst case for me is I have a loose wire somewhere throughout my entire electrical system :(
I appreciate your help guys! Thanks a lot
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 7:23 pm

Heh - yeah, the key switch is the switch you turn with the key ...

The starter cut out relay is part of the main relay assembly, which is the small black box with the 11-way connector behind the left seat panel.

Jsteen25
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 8:53 pm

Would getting a wire tester/volt reader thing to see if I can find any bad connections help? I have noticed that 5 wires on my main relay on the left rear panel have been cut and it looks like someone added something that has a green wire connected to it. It says pilot, but can't read the rest due to electrical tape over it.
If my starter relay is stuck in "on" is there a way to fix this or will buying a new one fix the problem?
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 9:08 pm

Jsteen25 wrote:Would getting a wire tester/volt reader thing to see if I can find any bad connections help? I have noticed that 5 wires on my main relay on the left rear panel have been cut and it looks like someone added something that has a green wire connected to it. It says pilot, but can't read the rest due to electrical tape over it.
If my starter relay is stuck in "on" is there a way to fix this or will buying a new one fix the problem?


WTF ...

Can you put up a photo of the relay assembly?

To all your individual questions - "Yes," but let's see if un-f!king your wiring will help first.

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Thedude055
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Thedude055 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:04 am

I have actually had similar issues with my bike and found that sections of my wiring harness were melted together causes problems. FZR's are notorious for having voltage regulator problems and when the stock ones go out they have a tendency to overload the system. For example most stock tachs don't work bulbs get blown out batteries boil over and burn up. Things like that are all common. I had a similar issue to yours and found that the plug assembly to the ignition switch was slightly melted and had two wires crossed. It took me about an hour with a voltmeter going through the harness wire by wire circuit by circuit to find the problem. I converted to an R6 regulator and patched up the harness and have no problems. Electrical demons are hard to pin point. My suggestions is to get the wiring diagram from the WIKI on this site and go through it wire by wire. You will be surprised what all you will find and fix.
1993 FZR600 streetfighter (because all of the fairings were destroyed when I got it)
Picture is of the bike as i got It. I will get new ones on here when i am done.
"Timshel"

Jsteen25
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:57 am

Hey guys sorry I can't figure out how to attach pics to this reply/post, neither can my dad(any suggestions will be great). We have a Mac btw. We don't know code so we figure we don't know how to do it lol. We were able to put them in my gallery however, so if you know how to go check out my gallery then you can see what the wiring looks like.
One important question though, is it dangerous or bad to my bike if I still go on rides during daylight? Like I said she starts right up and runs no problem.
Thanks
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 12:03 pm

Not sure how many of you are old enough to remember Higgins from 'Magnum P.I', but he said it best - "Oh. My. GOD!" :swear

What an absolute horror show. Yes, that dog's breakfast is exactly why you're having the problems that you are.

What's probably happened is the starter cut out relay in the assembly has failed, whether open or closed, and the previous owner has gone about this hack job to splice in a different relay. There was SOMETHING approaching thought to it, as he HAS incorporated the Neutral switch into this morass; presumably, this magical start-when-the-power-is-off ability your bike has only works when it's in neutral?

Best option is to replace the main relay, dump the kludge, and re-splice the wires to the connector. The Yamaha part is 3EN-81950-00-00, but is a little spendy at $79 + $7 shipping from Partzilla. There is a functionally equivalent 4TV-81950-00-00 on eBay right now for $24 + free shipping - might be an idea.

Is it safe to ride? I don't know that I'd ride without headlights - certainly, the local constabulary would agree :cop: . Riding with the messed up starter button - I dunno. That's a source of distraction at the wrong moment, or even engine damage ...

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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:21 pm

Doh! I kinda figured that my wiring was a little messed with heh. So is that "pilot" thing a new/different starter relay that they wired into my system? If I got rid of the "pilot" relay, do you think that my starter relay will work? (or should I just replace both the main relay and the starter relay, being that something went wrong w the original starter relay because they spliced a new one in) I'm sorry if that was confusing :/. kinda having trouble figuring out exactly what that "pilot" thing is and what its for.

I'm having trouble finding the part on ebay but the partzilla link is good so if all else fails i'll buy the new relay assy from yamaha. Is the functionally equivalent part a yzf model part?

Oh BTW I just went out and put the bike in 1st gear w/ killswitch off and key not even in ignition... and the bike still cranks over and pulls the bike forward as it should. then pulled the clutch in while in 1st and it still cranked over.
Thanks A Lot
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:55 pm

The main relay assembly includes the fuel pump relay, the starter cut-out relay, and a few diodes and resistors for the self-check and safety interlocks. This 'Pilot' thingy is a replacement for the starter cut-out relay, that prevents the starter from cranking the engine if the safety interlocks aren't satisfied (cranking in gear with the sidestand down is normally considered a "bad thing" :yuck: )

The actual starter relay / starter solenoid is the big can-shaped beast on the right side of the bike - follow the big heavy red wire from the battery. It's fine, and is doing what it's supposed to.

The 4TV part is from the YZF600 and the early R1. It'll do the job.

Jsteen25
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:15 pm

It's still not good but I didn't crank it w the side stand down, in gear, just w the side stand up in 1st.

But that black box that houses the 11 wires. Is this the main relay? Can i just yank the plastic housing clip w wires attached, out of the black box/ main relay thing. Or... When I buy that assy on partzilla will it include the wires w the plastic housing or is it just that black box/ main relay that attaches to the side of the bike.

I'm sorry if I'm becoming a burden by asking all these questions, just don't wanna spend so much if I can fix it.

So if I'm not mistaken (which is very possible btw) you feel that if I get rid of the pilot thingy and hook up all the wires where they belong on a new black box/ main relay assy, that my problems will be fixed?

Do you think I should take apart and clean my start button housing since its somewhat stinking when I push it in.

I'm not going to ride it until I figure this out, nless some reason I jut can't resist :).
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:22 pm

The green plastic piece with the cut wires is the connector; the wires to it need to be repaired. The black box is the main relay assembly; it needs to be replaced.

Yes, your starter button most certainly needs to be stripped and cleaned!

Don't worry about the questions - if I didn't enjoy it, I wouldn't answer them! :grinnod:

Jsteen25
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby Jsteen25 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:33 pm

Ok, so I can pull out the connector from the main relay/black box? It seems like you can but I cant get the thing out with my hands its in there pretty darn good.

As far as repairing the wires go, do I just need to make all the wires (11 of them I think) the same length and fit them back into the connector which fits into the main relay? There is 11 slots on my connector, are all of these spose to be filled with a wire? I dont know if I can find 11 wires to fit into my connector :/.

And for the start button? hehe.. soo I am a little mechanicly inclined when it comes to this but im not too sure of myself, and without diagrams or pics im hesitant on taking it apart. Do I just start taking out screws and keeping track of where everything goes? Can I easily mess up anything like my throttle cable adjustment, brake lever, etc.

Just to maybe kind of clear my head.. did they wire in this pilot relay because my starter cut off relay slot in my main relay went bad, and they were too lazy to replace it? It seems crazy to me that only 4 of the 11 slots on my connector are being used. HA!

And yea I just put it in 1st with the kickstand down and it still cranks over. not good. So what kind of possible engine damage would happen due to driving her like this?

Thanks A Lot!
1997 FZR600r

DonTZ125
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Re: electrical problem 97 fzr600

Postby DonTZ125 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:50 pm

Yeah, the connectors bite into those things pretty tight. There IS a little latch at the top in the middle; be sure it's popped before you get out the persuaders!

There are 10 wires going to that connector; one pin is left open. You have a total of 10 wires in that clusterf!k actually coming out of the harness or going into the connector; don't get confused with the green wire. Just splice them back together - get some heat shrink splices from the local auto parts store, strip 1/4" off each mating end, and apply heat per the directions. Should take you 5 minutes for the first repair; by the time you finish the last one, you'll be down to under a minute. There are two bLue/White wires, but they're part of the same circuit, so it doesn't matter which pin goes to the solenoid and which goes to the starter button.

I honestly don't know what the PO was trying to rectify, but you should take that Pilot relay down to the local rifle range and work off some frustration.

The first time you open a switch cluster is always a bit of an act of faith. Take it slow, take notes - heck, take photos! Strip everything away in a methodical manner, put it back in reverse order. One gotcha is the teeny little detent ball that lets the kill switch 'click' into position - it may just try to make a break for it, so be careful.

Depending on how things go, you might affect the adjustment of the throttle cable or brake lever, but this is a perfect time to lube and adjust them anyway. Think about it - how often do you lube the throttle tube, throttle cables, cable ends, brake lever pivot, brake lever push bolt? It's not a job - it's an adventure! :whistle :thumbsup:


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